View Full Version : Avi Transeivers
Affix Snow
10-21-2004, 04:30 PM
OK.
Looking into transeivers for this winter.
Any thoughts or experience out there?
Im Looking in to the BCA or Ortovox M2.
Not familiar at all, but taking courses and want my own :D
Thanks.
PWDR8S
10-21-2004, 04:48 PM
Good topic..... I'ld like to hear what's out there..... I don't have one myself although I have just about everything else I need and I SHOULD have one or two!
I'll dig up what I can.
skiyak777
10-21-2004, 05:52 PM
OK.
Looking into transeivers for this winter.
Any thoughts or experience out there?
Im Looking in to the BCA or Ortovox M2.
Not familiar at all, but taking courses and want my own :D
Thanks.
I've got a pair of Ortovox M2s. Work great, but require reading the manual and practice.
I've been told that newer dual or triple antenna beacons like the BCA are basically idiot proof, so you can loan one to a friend with no experience and they still have a chance of finding you, but they have a slight disadvantage in terms of range.
I think Couloir reviewed beacons recently. Might be worth checking their website.
Tommy T
10-21-2004, 06:25 PM
[QUOTE=skiyak777]
I've been told that newer dual or triple antenna beacons like the BCA are basically idiot proof, so you can loan one to a friend with no experience and they still have a chance of finding you, but they have a slight disadvantage in terms of range.
QUOTE]
This is exactly what the Couloir survey reported. Couloir did make the point that disadvantage in range is really not an issue for a non-professional trying to do an quick emergency search and dig for a live buddy. The range issue comes when the pros are doing a corpse recovery from a really deep burial or from a large area of possible location. The range is plenty sufficient for any situation where the victim is apt to be found alive.
I've used double antenna beacons (in practice situations) and they are idiot proof -- no tangent lines or grid work -- just follow the direction indicator in.
Tommy T.
I got a Tracker... Most of my friends do as well... A couple of my friends have Pieps..
The Tracker points you directly to the target... Gives you the distance in meters.. Has a mulitple search feature that picks up on the strongest signal and zeros in on it... Does well until you hit the flux close in then you gotta know what your doing...
The Peips are audible only... I've used them before so if I'm going in out and someone doesnt have a lot of experience - I'll give the BCA to them and I'll take the Peip...
Our SP at Hunter has a proForm so lot's of people I know have the BCA TRackers...
At our avalanche training people wiht BCA's were finding the targets faster then most...
I'll have them up at Hunter - If you want to check them out...
The range is plenty sufficient for any situation where the victim is apt to be found alive.
Excellent point..
Ispoiler
10-21-2004, 07:03 PM
After reading all the pro and cons in Coulior's reviews as well as picking the brains of a bunch of people I decied to go with the Tracker. There is a nice package at Bent Gate for $339 which includes the Tracker, BD Telelynx shove, and G3 probe. I think I just might order it right now.
http://www.bentgate.net/avypkg.html
mainwaring
10-21-2004, 09:45 PM
the couloir review is pretty comprehensive and provides alot of information. i'd start there if you want to know more than you even wanted to know...including the science.
personally, i've used the f1, pieps 457, m2, tracker and the barryvox/mammut. all were good in different ways, very much in line with the couloir review. i am not of the mind that any one is better than any other. i think experience with them is what counts most.
whatever you choose, practice with it as much as you can to get comfortable with it and take an avy course which will offer practice burial scenarios. better yet, take the course prior to buying one and use as many different beacons as possible and choose the one with which you are most comfortable.
Justin
10-22-2004, 11:00 AM
I've got Mammut. http://www.barryvox.com/productfamily/mammut/index_e.html I'd recommend it. The tracker is real nice, I've used that one as well. Just Makes sure that you beacon is digital. Analog transceivers are not only next to obsolete, but alot harder to use.
They have a shorter range too. Although i seem to the only one this Does matter. Ever see a avalanche in person? I say a dudes ski float close to 1000ft before going under. If that was me down there i would be concerned with the range of my buddies beacons.
I've got Mammut. http://www.barryvox.com/productfamily/mammut/index_e.html I'd recommend it.
I used a Barryvox once and liked it a lot...
My decision came down to cost... I was able to get a Tracker for cheap... And i liked it so it was a "no brainer"...
If you take an avi class at Pinham Notch they have a bunch of differtent kinds of tranceivers and people in the class bring there own if they have them... So you get to try a bunch out...
el-bagr
10-22-2004, 11:07 AM
Some review links:
Couloir 2004 (http://www.telemarkskier.com/pdfs/v16pdfs/pdf-wnt04/Beacons04web.pdf) (PDF)
Couloir 2001 (http://www.couloirmag.com/gear/avy_gear/v13_beacons.pdf) (PDF)
Couloir 1999 (www.couloirmag.com/gear/avy_gear/beacons99.htm)
Couloir general info (http://www.couloirmag.com/special/mag_pdfs/beacon_series_pdf.asp)
PWDR8S
10-22-2004, 04:00 PM
Thanks guys! This may help save a few lives.
Perhaps Dave or M@ can relocate this thread to an AVI education section.
Affix Snow
10-22-2004, 05:49 PM
I think im gettin the BCA tracker....liked what i read.
Bring it up to Hunter sometime... We'll practice...
Affix Snow
10-25-2004, 10:33 AM
Bring it up to Hunter sometime... We'll practice...
Count on it! Great idea. We shall practice.
I was thinking, it would be fun to give a drunk freind one and later when ya cant find him, go look....then again it might get broken and if he was out of range....nevermind.
Count on it! Great idea. We shall practice.
I was thinking, it would be fun to give a drunk freind one and later when ya cant find him, go look....then again it might get broken and if he was out of range....nevermind.
If your really want to have fun during a practice...
Put the tranciever in a tree.... We sat and laughed for 10 minutes once - while we watched a friend walking in circles - digging digging digging looking for it.... :)
Affix Snow
10-25-2004, 10:41 AM
If your really want to have fun during a practice...
Put the tranciever in a tree.... We sat and laughed for 10 minutes once - while we watched a friend walking in circles - digging digging digging looking for it.... :)
Ill keep that in mind when i come up ;)
Ill keep that in mind when i come up ;)
damn.... I shouldnt have told you... It's kind of an initiation thing...
Like when your mountain biking with someone for the first time and you get them to try and go through a mudpit that you just walked around cause it's too deep to make it through... :)
Affix Snow
10-25-2004, 10:49 AM
damn.... I shouldnt have told you... It's kind of an initiation thing...
Like when your mountain biking with someone for the first time and you get them to try and go through a mudpit that you just walked around cause it's too deep to make it through... :)
Ill most likely forget about it when i come up and be wandering around anyway :) Either that, or ill pretend. For the sake of initiation. :D
Justin
10-25-2004, 10:58 AM
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=36268&item=7109663787&rd=1
Not a bad price. It's hard to find 'em much under 300...
PWDR8S
10-25-2004, 12:04 PM
Good price but 6 days left on the auction.....
I wonder if any offer 2 at a discount..... I'ld have to get 2 because sometimes others either forget theirs(foolish) or they just never got around to buying their own.
Justin
10-25-2004, 12:45 PM
Well, there was a 'but it now' option when i first looked at it (for 239) Now it'll probably shoot up to the standard 300 mark.
Justin
10-25-2004, 02:45 PM
If your looking, surely you'll be interested in this...
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=21232&item=7108652029&rd=1
PWDR8S
10-25-2004, 04:58 PM
If your looking, surely you'll be interested in this...
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=21232&item=7108652029&rd=1 Thanks.... the bidding quickly escalated beyond my comfort zone .... over $200... oh well... there will be more.
jshefftz
10-27-2004, 01:17 PM
If you contribute at least $15 (tax deductible!) to:
http://www.csac.org
. . . then you get very substantial discounts on beacons.
mainwaring
10-30-2004, 05:26 PM
fyi...an informative fireld review of the barryvox by lou dawson...
http://wildsnow.com/articles/barryvox/barryvox_review.html
lacman
11-13-2004, 12:44 PM
If there's anything that's seemingly missing from this thread, it's this:
A transceiver is only good for locating a burial. You'd better be sure that you and all your buddies have shovels and probes to go along with the beacon. To dig through avy debris by hand or ice ax virtually ensures that you're doing a recovery, not a rescue.
On top of all that, I'd say that until you take a basic course like AIARE Level 1, you shouldn't even be in avalanche terrain, unless you enjoy the possibility of killing yourself or others that might be below you.
If there's anything that's seemingly missing from this thread, it's this:
A transceiver is only good for locating a burial. You'd better be sure that you and all your buddies have shovels and probes to go along with the beacon. To dig through avy debris by hand or ice ax virtually ensures that you're doing a recovery, not a rescue.
On top of all that, I'd say that until you take a basic course like AIARE Level 1, you shouldn't even be in avalanche terrain, unless you enjoy the possibility of killing yourself or others that might be below you.By that logic none of the great climbs and descents done before the advent of beacons "should" have been done. Too bad, I guess they don't count.
I doubt Barber & Cilley had beacons on Katahdin....though my guess is Henry uses one ocasionally these days.
No matter though, the basic point about thinking the gear list through is very sound. Shovel and probe do live in my pack....that way I can dig while others locate. I'll get the transceiver this season. Likely I will practice hide and seek with the crew before I take a lesson....
Affix Snow
11-15-2004, 04:21 PM
If there's anything that's seemingly missing from this thread, it's this:
A transceiver is only good for locating a burial. You'd better be sure that you and all your buddies have shovels and probes to go along with the beacon. To dig through avy debris by hand or ice ax virtually ensures that you're doing a recovery, not a rescue.
On top of all that, I'd say that until you take a basic course like AIARE Level 1, you shouldn't even be in avalanche terrain, unless you enjoy the possibility of killing yourself or others that might be below you.
This thread was about TRANSIEVERS, so sorry if we didnt cover EVERY aspect of avalanche rescue....
Attention ALL:
IN THE FUTURE, TRY AND COVER EVERY ASPECT OF A TOPIC SO YOU DO NOT OFFEND ANYONE. FOR INSTANCE, WHEN DISCUSSING A BAND, MAKE SURE YOU INCLUDE ALL THE BANDS INFLUENCES AND A COMPLETE DISCOGRAPHY....OR WHEN DECIDING ON WHAT JEANS TO BUY, PLEASE CONSIDER WHAT SOCKS AND SHIRT TO PURCHASE, CAUSE IT IS UNSAFE TO LEAVE THE HOUSE WITHOUT THEM.
THANK YOU
SINCERELY,
CAPTAIN OBVIOUS ;)
mainwaring
11-15-2004, 05:01 PM
more important than the tools are your brain...which should always be making safe route and weather/risk assessments for your group and others you may be affecting.
but as far as the brain goes...mine tells me that the reply above by lacman also contained some level of condescension. i don't know who if anyone should be the big boss of the backcountry allowing some and not others to explore. what's next...only GOOD drivers should be permitted to drive on highways? good luck getting anyone to see themselves as a bad driver. seems to smack a little bit of a holier-than-thou mentality.
lacman, do you have bonified experience and credentials in the backcountry? are you a professional of some sort that is merely venting because you find the level of outdoor awareness alarming? or are you simply stating things you read in a book?
i have great respect for experience and will often trust in well earned advice. but i do tend to have a problem with "authority" when it is eschewed without requisite experience. some context might help your post...
"avalanche terrain" describes most of the skiable terrain in bounds in ski areas...are you suggesting that everyone who resort skis should have L1 avalanche training prior to stepping on the slopes?
"virtually ensures"...do you have some empirical evidence on this? you might want to send it to avalanche professionals to include in their research. the only thing that seems to be virtually ensured to me is that you won't ever be in an avalanche while on your couch at home.
nonetheless, training in avalanche awareness is vital, and i agree with most of the ideals of the post, though i think it could be done with less cant.
I have a couple of guesses as to lacmans secret identity...both of them have buckets of the requisite experience and honest to goodness credentials worthy of respect....
still, after the third :beer: pontification goes poorly...or is it the other way round?
mainwaring
11-15-2004, 05:26 PM
I have a couple of guesses as to lacmans secret identity...both of them have buckets of the requisite experience and honest to goodness credentials worthy of respect....
still, after the third :beer: pontification goes poorly...or is it the other way round?
after the 3rd pontification beer goes poorly?
well, most of us have probably FWI'ed (flamed while intoxicated) at one time or another...so under that context, cheers, lacman.
after the 3rd pontification beer goes poorly?
well, most of us have probably FWI'ed (flamed while intoxicated) at one time or another...so under that context, cheers, lacman.prezackly :beer:
Ispoiler
11-16-2004, 07:40 PM
I am going to have to disagree with the flaming on this one, the are plenty of people like myself who don't have enough experience to make the most sound judgment in the backcountry. I do know enough to keep myself out of situations I don't understand with regard to snow pack and possible hazards. Like many other people I was a ****y lurker not all that long ago, posts of that tone are necessary to scare some respect into people who wouldn't know otherwise.
Hopefully we didn't chase away someone who could share alot with us.
vBulletin® v3.8.7, Copyright ©2000-2013, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.