newbee - a few un-answered questionz

ok these may be answered somwhere but I'm looking for specifics:
Drive time and directions from Stratton VT / Bondville (these I can find) but looking for best way - if known
Time of arrival, for real, like if I get there at 9am with walk in (how long in dist/hours) to ride / eat/ observe/ video tape - will I be able to get there, get a run in and get back before nightfall - without rushing. I realize other people ahead of me will set the pace of the hike/walk. So how far from train head to lunch rocks then up to point of starting ride, is the hike deadly or ???. ALSO when I get to the bottom of my run - can I get back to lunch rocks or the trail easily? - I ask because I MIGHT have a dog with me and I don't think he'll be running down next to me on the run (steep) so I need to leave him somwhere I can get back to (location/person).
Ok there's more: I will be riding a snowboard (on the Snow) and plan to hike in the Burton Snowboard boots ? Bad Idea? - I have worn them for backcountry snow hiking, but am unsure of the "trail" up to the riding area. Use of sticks/ hiking poles good idea? Any other little help would be greatly appreciated - trippin on April 28th.
Thanks in advance for any help. look for white dog red pack, Burton white Canyon board - BIG.

thanks

[M@]

Hey Dood:

The website that hosts this message-board has most of the info your ask about: http://timefortuckerman.com/tuckerman1.html == directions

As for a dog: That's about RESPONSIBILITY. I've got a great dog, sticks with me no matter what, but I'd aint bringing her the Tuckerman becuase it's not healthy for her.

Every year there's a dog or two on the trail without anyone with them - and a couple of times people have to hike all the way back down to find their dog.

Then there's that "Real-TV" segment, shot at TUCKERMAN, of some guy skiing the head wall with his dog, and the pooch ends up cartweeling all the way down the bowl. Dog was lucky, but it was pretty scary.

Last year a guy in our lean-to brought his dog, and we camped, and it was a big hassell having to keep the dog away from the caretaker becuase dogs ain't supposed to camp in the cutler protection area.

My sister, who just day-hiked, brought her dog, and he had a blast. She doesn't ski and was able to watch her dog the whole time, and keep him on a leash when around other people etc... so if that's your plan, your dog will have a blast.

Boots: I'd suggest wearing hiking boots to hike, and snow-boarding boots to snowboard. From the base of your run, wear the snow-board boots. But to get from Pinkham to the Bowl you'll want hiking boots.

Anyway, think it through, sorry to lay the "responbility" trip... but I've been there, and I aint bringing my dog.

M@

[SherpaKroto]

Rough (generous times allowed):
3 hours to get to base of Ravine(allows for video time, etc.)
1/2 hour per run
2 hours back.
Poles very useful (trek poles best - put them in pack when not using)
Good pack with board firmly attached.

Hike is moderate, but relentless. Grade doesn't change much from the base to Lion Head Trail, and again above Hermit Lake. Check out pics elsewhere in this site or http://www.tuckerman.org. Lunch Rocks is right side of the ravine (in the bowl). You can ski/climb from there between runs. Trail is easy to follow back (hundreds will be headed the same way). Dogs have a blast, but you should have someone familiar with the dog watching him. The bowl is too steep for a dog to come down IMO, although many climb up and end up rolling back down. Can't comment on hiking in snowboard boots, but I've seen many who do. The trail is mostly rounded boulders the entire way. We'll also be there on the 28th. I'm 45, Blue Gore-tex shell/black bibs/K2 Merlins/Teal Langes. Say Hey if you see us - SherpaKroto

[VTrider]

Originally posted by msheppard:
Hey Dood:
Then there's that "Real-TV" segment, shot at TUCKERMAN, of some guy skiing the head wall with his dog, and the pooch ends up cartweeling all the way down the bowl. Dog was lucky, but it was pretty scary.

Probably the saddest thing i've seen up in the bowl was watching a dog 'cartwheeling' down out of control only to stop motionless - it died of a broken neck Everybody on the lunchrocks were hooting/hollering as usual to the sight of this gal and her dog desecending, the dog quickly built of speed and lost it - everyone go really quiet and just 'shocked' expressions. The poor gal was devasted and in tears, many others around started to cry, it sucked.

On a lighter and less serious note, last Spring my ex-girlfriends dog decided to do a 180 half way up the trail and walked herself all the way back to the trailhead! Heh! She was pissed, had to hike all the way back down then all the way back up again, almost 4 hours later she arrived at the rocks.

Dogs seem to have a great time up there though, and I would definately recommend bringing your furry friend. I would just use some common sense/caution.

Hey rideon69, the first year I used softboots up in the bowl, I decided to hike up the trail in them also, never will do it again!! If the hike wasn't as long, I would reconsider, but after the first 1hr those boots seemed like lead weights and jeeez were they HOT. I always bring ski poles on the hike, I think they help out w/my balance and make life easier heading up the trail.

I'm an instructor over in N. Vermont, I'll also be up there the 28th w/about 25 other friends from the mountain. Well be camping over at Dolly Copp Fri/Sat night.

- VTrider

Ditto on the responsibility thing for your dog. I brought mine a few years ago. If you have someone to watch him/her when you do the steep stuff, cool. (I actually had to use duct tape and a sock to wrap a slice on his foot from hiking. He didn't care.) I compromised and brought him 1/3 the way up the bowl and skiied down. He had a good time, but would you really risk breaking your dogs neck on the steep stuff? Also, the sherburne ski trail is a blast, but there is no way that a dog can keep up with you, so you'll have to keep stopping to wait. . . . . . . .

[VTrider]

I gotta give some dogs credit though, esp. the one's which hike up higher than you in the bowl! I remember one of first times I started hiking up and over, I was on left chute white as a ghost, trying to kick my boots into the snow. I remember saying to myself 'this is cake', then after 5 minutes or so I looked down below me and almost **** my pants! I was at that point where you can't go back down, you can't stay where you are, and the only real option is to move ahead. Well, as I was hanging on trying to rationalize my life, here comes fido just carefully and seemingly technically struttin his little paws right up beside and past me w/his owner right beside him! I just had to laugh at the irony, this little dog had more balls than I? Very humbling experience.

-VTrider

[notjustanotherboarder]

I hear ya, bud. I'm glad someone else is using their head a little bit up there. Last time I mentioned using safety equipment, I got some smart-ass response. Plus having a transceiver doesn't do me much good if no one else has one. By the way, I last went in early Feb. How was the snow/ice last week???, how many people???

[VTrider]

<snip>

Originally posted by rideon69:
ALSO when I get to the bottom of my run - can I get back to lunch rocks or the trail easily? - I ask because I MIGHT have a dog with me and I don't think he'll be running down next to me on the run (steep) so I need to leave him somwhere I can get back to (location/person)

Although I've seen some scary things and close calls with dogs up there in the past, I still see know reason why you 'shouldn't' bring a dog up there as long as you take the responsibility for it. Dogs running around the bottom of the bowl are like pins are to a bowling ball.

-VTrider

dogs:

I was watching a guy last week dropping over the cornice into Lobster Claw with his dog and one of the people sitting next to me commented, "God, I hate when people are so inconsiderate about their dogs life like that". The funny thing was, the dog was more at ease than the skier - it was doing all the right things and very comfortable where he was. Some dogs are good in the bc and shouldn't be looked down upon because some owners aren't capable of controlling their pets.

All the things wildbill mentioned that's resulted from dogs has happened to me over the years resulting from incompetent, out-a-shape skiers - SHOULD WE BAN THESE PEOPLE AS WELL?

Sure "Twist," ban the incompetent skier/ boarders. Great advice. But the reality of the situation is that the dog is going to go wherever the owner takes it. No matter how good the owner is on the steep ****, he or the dog could get seriously effed up. I've seen dogs do really well up there too. Maybe it's not such a good idea to advise someone to bring their dog up bowl so that they can find out "is this dog one of the cool downhill dogs, or will it get hurt, or both?"
All the basic laws of physics apply to dogs- what goes up must come down.

[Jib_Boarder]

good to know

[RR]

I have used adjustable hiking poles for years, they are a really big help. This year I finally sprung loos of some cash for adjustable skipoles (BD Expedition) and the security is way up!

If your day arrives and conditions are extra crispy (icy), then having some crampons and an ice axe will be really important to ascent of the various riding lines.

Problem with those days is that heel-side edging is way important! Loose that edge because your boots stick out and it's see you at the bottom and right now. Think about that one, wide is good!

[BladeGirl]

Well THIS topic really brought out the "oldtimers" (Members number 6,23,33,37, not to mention M@, who is always with us)!

Rideon, there are two "official" T4T member trips planned in the spring, if you want to go with folks from the Board. Check the T4T calendar.

-BG

[2plankerider]

ummmmm let's see... i own 2 dogs. my advice would be listen to what everyone before me said i have taken the pups up to the ravine when i have been up there to "hang out" and it was fine. i would NEVER bring them if i were skiing/riding.

a word on collapsable get the ones that have a quick release latch, not the screw kind as they tend to have slippage. in other words they may not tighten all the way and will end up retracting just as you put some weight on them. BLack Diamond makes a sweet pair. and yes, it is nice to have them even if yer gonna

bring yer hiking and the hike is TWICE as long when yer hungover

one last word of advice...leave a few cold ones in the snowbank of the parking lot. BEST you'll ever have.
and don't forget yer