share your experience with At bindings....

[footlong]

I'm looking for some input from others on this. I have the Fritschi (sp.?) freeride bindings. I have no problems with the getting in and out of them. I have never had a problem with a premature ejection ( ) or with the binding NOT releasing when I wanted it to. This being my first AT binding, I am quite happy with the weight, as compared to alpine bindings.....

MY problem is that I have found the bindings to change the character of the ski performance. I have had these mounted on a pair of Dynastar Little Big Fat's (a GREAT soft snow ski) as well as their current home on a pair of Volkl G41s. In both instances, the Fritchis were the second binding on the ski so I had a direct performance comparison for each setup.

The Fritschi's seem to create a 'dead spot' in the flex pattern of the ski which significantly changes how the ski performs. so much so that my Dynastar's couldn't hold the slightest edge of firm snow but would chatter and dance across the snow to the point of being ridiculous. I was so disappointed, I ended up selling the skiis (mistake, I now realize) and putting the bindings on the Volkls. This was following the logic that I needed a stiffer ski (all being relative - the G41 is soft for a Volkl but he Little Big Fat was a REAL softie).

The Volkls had their original alpines removed and the Fritchi's installed. I realized what was going on in the first couple turns - it was the bindings....apparently due to the rail that goes under foot to connect the toe piece and the heel piece inhibiting the ski flex under foot.

Well, the bindings reside on the Volkls and I put up with it but I am curious as to whether or not this a characteristic of all AT bindings or if one or more of the other choices out there do not share this same inherent performance flaw....

Discuss!

[Justin]

Yep. fritschi bindings have LESS of a forward cant (sp?) than regular Alpine binders. I found the loss of downhill performance to be noticable, but after a couple days, i was used to it and the advantages are obvious (duh). obviously boots make a huge difference too.

FWIW, you can get shims for the rear of the binder...

[RR]

I recall that the Naxo rail slides freely in the lockdown element allowing a natural skiflex. That was pointed out in comparisin of the Freeride rail being trapped in the lockdown element, shortening the natural skiflex.

[yuckster]

Originally Posted by footlong

The Fritschi's seem to create a 'dead spot' in the flex pattern of the ski which significantly changes how the ski performs. so much so that my Dynastar's couldn't hold the slightest edge of firm snow but would chatter and dance across the snow to the point of being ridiculous. I was so disappointed, I ended up selling the skiis (mistake, I now realize) and putting the bindings on the Volkls. This was following the logic that I needed a stiffer ski (all being relative - the G41 is soft for a Volkl but he Little Big Fat was a REAL softie).

You might want to experiment with mounting a little farther forward and detuning your tip/tail. See comments on Lou Dawson's review of the BD Mira on wildsnow.com... though the Mira is a relatively straight ski, with a turn radius of 22 or 24m.

I think the naxo binding is supposed to allow more ski flex, also

[awf170]

How do Freerides stop the ski from flexing? I don't get it, the heel isn't locked in place. I would think Freerides would allow the ski to flex more than with a regular binding (not on a rail system).

[RR]

There are stops build into the lockdown assmbly of the Freerides, but the rail does in fact float during skiflex. On my skis there is about half a centimeter of movement before the stop is engaged by the rail during skiflex. My Freerides are mounted on Crossbows and occasionally tap the stops when I am skiing, some folks bend'em more than I do and for them that might be an issue.

I believe the Naxo has a bit more range.

[yuckster]

Whatever footlong's problem is, I suspect it's not flex related. Maybe mounting position, maybe a smaller ramp angle is throwing him into the backseat and he doesn't realize that is an issue.

If it's ramp angle one option is to take the shims out of the toe. (Be careful with screw length...)

Lou Dawson gets into some other modification options on wildsnow.com

[Jolly J]

I have Naxo nx21's. There is no stop. The rails float under the lockdown mech.

[riverc0il]

I have a pair of skis mounted both with AT (Freerides) and another pair of the same skis mounted Alpine (Look P12s) and have noticed only the smallest and most minor performance variances. The ramp angle was certainly the most noticeable. The fixes have been noted already, either shimming the rear or removing the shim on the toe piece. I would not recommend either as I got used to the ramp angle quickly and can even switch between the Freeride and P12 within the same day easily enough. I have not noticed any major performance issues. If anything, having a riser on the Freeride, that should actually help with carving in some aspects. The natural flex pattern of the ski is probably compromised slightly from my experiences, but it has yet to make a major noticeable difference. I would verify the mounting of the bindings was done correctly. Perhaps check the boot center mark on the boots/ski and verify you are not feeling the differences of a different mounting point. Even a 1cm difference can change the skis feel dramatically.

[yuckster]

And when you think about it why wouldn't the mount be a little different. These skis already had a different pair of bindings on them maybe the tech had to move off center to drill new holes that would fit. If it hasn't been too long ask the tech?

[NtrentT]

I have a pair of older Fritschi Titnaial II's mounted on 172 Atomic Tacoras, I have no complaints at all.

Going to try my new G-rides with them on Sunday.

CANT WAIT.

This is my first season with them, and Ive used them.....
on:
Shurby 1
Thunderbolt 1
Riverton BC 1
New Hartford BC 1
Resort stlye 3

No performance issues at all, I dont think my rail floats with the flex, maybe the newer ones do.

[ATP]

It may be that my 10exes are too stiff for me to bend the midbody far enought to drive the binding all the way to the stop, but that is something I've not noticed in 4 years of fairly hard-charging skiing. However, the lack of ramp angle was quite noticeable at first, and there is some lateral play in the binding, which could be an issue for a more precise skier than I.

Just steer clear of the Pures. Lou Dawson recently did a durability review, considering several incarnations of the binding, and concluded they still didn't have them right.

[footlong]

Whew! thank goodness it isn't the binding and it's only me! All good feedback - much appreciated. I will take a closer look at the binding mounting location tonite as I'm throwing on some wax - that does make some sense as both skiis that 'wore' these bindings had been previously mounted...hmmm....time for a NEW pair of skiis! Yeah, THAT's the answer!

As to the ramp angle and shims, again - hmmm....had not noticed this but will try to pay attention tomorrow and see if I notice anything here....

Glad to hear there is no inherent design flaw in the bindings that detrimentally affect ski performance...I'll just have to come up with some other excuse, I guess...HEE-HEEE!

Anyone have any experience on Atomic Sugar Daddy's? A friend of mine has a slightly used pair for rock bottom (he's skiis groomers only...)....from what little I have read, these might be a good choice....

By the way, snow started in Jericho,VT at 7:20. It was pretty cool as it was a slowly advancing wall of white, like a summer shower coming through, only it is coming down light with no wind. Forecast is for around a foot here, give or take 6 inches...we'll see by morning....and I'll post a TR!

[RR]

Originally Posted by footlong

...I'll just have to come up with some other excuse, I guess...HEE-HEEE!...

You may most certainly borrow my favorite excuse, after all I borrowed it from the Vermin and I sure ain't gonna give it back:

Before the last part of gearing up pull a 500 count bottle of Ibuprophen out of your gear bag shake it so the half dozen tablets rattle pitifully and exclaim tiredly, "Damn, these things just don't last like they used to!" Take three, wash them down with some Pepto and remark sadly, "That might help." Then shake your head as you walk gingerly toward the door.

If you kill it all day you are an extra stud....if you stink all day you have your excuse and you don't have to say a word....

[footlong]

You will all be relieved to knoiw that, after taking a close look at the binding mount location, it is most DEFINITELY the fault of 1) the tech who did such a far from brilliant job of mounting the bindings , not only off center but different distances off center (one about 1 cm, the other about 2cm), 2)my extreme brilliance in not noticing that the bindings weren't mounted symetrically....of course, the tech could hide behind the excuse of having to avoid the previous holes. Me, I got nothing....still, I skiid'm in powder this morning and had a helluva good time anyway! <LOL>