T4T Forums - Tuckerman Ravine NH  

Go Back   T4T Forums - Tuckerman Ravine NH > Lunch Rocks > Gear Talk

Reply
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
  #1  
Old 05-07-2007, 01:49 PM
RR's Avatar
RR RR is offline
Moderator
Toni Matt Club **
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: following Diogenes, but the ba$tard threw away the lamp so I'm just stumbling along in the dark!
Posts: 13,750
RR has a reputation beyond reputeRR has a reputation beyond reputeRR has a reputation beyond reputeRR has a reputation beyond reputeRR has a reputation beyond reputeRR has a reputation beyond reputeRR has a reputation beyond reputeRR has a reputation beyond reputeRR has a reputation beyond reputeRR has a reputation beyond reputeRR has a reputation beyond repute
MSR Reactor - another stove

Thanks to PWDR8S for mentioning it I went looking to beta.

Here is what Duane Raleigh says about it in a head-to-head battle with the Jetboil (btw: the Reactor has a built-in starter theses days. There is a great picture in the article, a pdf file- http://www.msrcorp.com/rock_ice_reactor.pdf)

fireversusfire
Weight
msr reactor 20 ounces with 2-quart pot
Jetboil 15 ounces with 1.25-quart pot
(also available with 1.5 liter pot;add 4 ounces)
Boil times at 65 degrees F
reactor 2:38 minimum; 4:50 maximum
Jetboil 4:49 minimum; 8:50 maximum
Boil time at 9 degrees F
reactor 5:25
Jetboil 10:24
Boil time in 7mph Wind
reactor 2:58
Jetboil would not boil
Number of quarts Boiled
(220-gram propane/butane mix)
reactor 24
Jetboil 28
total Burn time
reactor 77 minutes
Jetboil 197 minutes


It was only a matter of tIme before
MSR, the Toyota of climbing and backpacking stoves,
picked up the gauntlet shoved down its throat three
years ago by the upstart Jetboil, which unleashed an
integrated stove and pot that touted fast boil times,
decent performance in wind, and the best fuel-effi-
ciency ever seen in a propane/butane canister cooker.
Jetboil did this by inventing a more-efficient heattransfer
system. Rather than relying on a simple
flame licking the bottom of a pot, Jetboil welded a
heat-absorbing radiator to the pot. The accordianlike
device absorbs heat that would normally be lost
and transfers it to the pot. Simple and effective. Jetboil,
the first real stove innovation in decades, was
an overnight sensation and developed a new category
in which it was all alone.
It took MSR’s best minds several years to work out
the bugs, but their Reactor is in most regards the bestperforming
canister stove yet. Like the Jetboil, the
Reactor sports a heat-exchanger on the bottom of the
cookpot. In this case, however, the heat-exchanger is
larger and heftier, improving heat absorption. Moreover,
a special fabric-like material covers the heat
source, making it virtually flameless. The fabric
glows red hot like a branding iron, rather than spits
wasteful flame into the air like a conventional burner.
The bottom of the pot, which is concave, nests over
the convex burner. The close fit and the combination
of the stove’s convection and conduction properties
make the Reactor virtually impervious to wind. A
swing lever lets you control the heat from maximum
blast to simmer.
With a full canister, the Reactor boiled a quart of
water in just under three minutes, the equivalent of
breaking the sound barrier in the world of camping
stoves. And, owing to a built-in pressure regulator,
the Reactor largely kept that performance, never
taking longer than four minutes to boil even when
the canister was nearly empty. In comparison, other
canister stoves, including the Jetboil, saw a radical
decrease in heat output as the canister gas depleted,
taking nearly twice as long to boil the last quart of
water as the first.
But that’s indoors, where even a pile of Kingsford
briquettes will perform admirably. Only in the wind
and cold can you separate the wheat from the chaff.
Here, the whisper-quiet Reactor pulled away with the
ease of a floored Lamborghini. In a 7 mph wind—a stiff
breeze—the Reactor still boiled in under three minutes.
For perspective on this water-to-wine miracle, of
the 23 other stoves I’ve tested in the past three years,
not a single one including the Jetboil could boil water
in under 10 minutes in the same conditions.
The Reactor’s cold-weather performance, the bane
of canister stoves, was also standard-setting. Typically,
below-freezing temps cause canister fuel’s vapor pressure
to drop and burner output to plummet, often to
the point where the stove will no longer function. At
9 degrees F, however, the Reactor’s pressure regulator
let it boil a quart of water in 5:25—a time that bests
some canister stoves’ warm-weather performances.
Weaknesses? Costing nearly $140, you’d expect
the Reactor to at least come with a coupon for a
neck rub. The Reactor package is also heavy. The
burner component itself weighs only 6 ounces, but
the hefty heat-exchanger bumps up the weight to a
whopping 20 ounces. If you’re looking for a featherweight
cooker, one to toss in your pack “just in
case” or for brewing up now and then, this isn’t it.
The Reactor, like the Jetboil, also only functions
with its pot component. Meals are limited to one-pot
dehydrated affairs, rice and the like—no bacon and
eggs for you! The pot’s two-quart capacity would
be good for melting snow.
The Jetboil does outshine the Reactor for pure
fuel efficiency, although barely. In a head-to-head
test, the Jetboil boiled 28 quarts of water, and had
an elapsed burn time of 197 minutes, compared to
24 quarts boiled and a 77-minute burn time for the
Reactor. (Tests used a 220-gram propane/butane
mix.) Lastly, the Jetboil’s built-in electric ignition
simplifies lighting up. Presently, MSR is working on
an electric-ignition, but the current Reactor lacks
one—don’t forget to pack a lighter.
Recommendations? The Reactor would be just
about ideal for two people preparing hot meals
for more than one day. Its wind- and cold-weather
performances put it at the top of my list for alpine
climbing and situations where you melt snow for
water. While the stove’s long-term durability and
field-repair-ability are yet to be proven (I did test the
stove 30 times and encountered no problems), it’s
clean, no-fuss operation and fast boil times make it
the only propane-canister stove that trumps whitegas
stoves in an alpine or mountain environment.
—Duane Raleigh
__________________
"Moderate is not the new Low" - Chris Joosen, USFS Lead Snow Ranger.
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 05-07-2007, 02:01 PM
pulverschwein pulverschwein is offline
Toni Matt Club *
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Manasquan, NJ
Posts: 1,352
pulverschwein has a brilliant futurepulverschwein has a brilliant futurepulverschwein has a brilliant futurepulverschwein has a brilliant futurepulverschwein has a brilliant futurepulverschwein has a brilliant futurepulverschwein has a brilliant futurepulverschwein has a brilliant futurepulverschwein has a brilliant futurepulverschwein has a brilliant futurepulverschwein has a brilliant future
Quote:
Originally Posted by RR
Thanks to PWDR8S for mentioning it I went looking to beta.
Thanks to both of y'all.
__________________
You can't just let nature run wild. We've got to pause and ask ourselves: How much clean air do we need?
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 05-07-2007, 02:26 PM
Affix Snow's Avatar
Affix Snow Affix Snow is offline
Toni Matt Club **
Purple Butt Club
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Lost
Posts: 6,010
Affix Snow has a reputation beyond reputeAffix Snow has a reputation beyond reputeAffix Snow has a reputation beyond reputeAffix Snow has a reputation beyond reputeAffix Snow has a reputation beyond reputeAffix Snow has a reputation beyond reputeAffix Snow has a reputation beyond reputeAffix Snow has a reputation beyond reputeAffix Snow has a reputation beyond reputeAffix Snow has a reputation beyond reputeAffix Snow has a reputation beyond repute
Ive been looking to pick the Reactor up for a while......seems pretty dope.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 05-07-2007, 02:47 PM
Fanatic1's Avatar
Fanatic1 Fanatic1 is offline
Left Gully Master
 
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Golden, CO
Posts: 169
Fanatic1 has a spectacular aura aboutFanatic1 has a spectacular aura aboutFanatic1 has a spectacular aura about
Send a message via Yahoo to Fanatic1
Looks like it will be the one to go with when it's available...Just got off the phone with MSR in Washington and it is due out in June but no promises were made!
__________________
Get to where you want to go!
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 05-07-2007, 03:20 PM
PWDR8S's Avatar
PWDR8S PWDR8S is offline
Toni Matt Club **
Smilie Abuser
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Lake Sunapee
Posts: 7,996
PWDR8S has a reputation beyond reputePWDR8S has a reputation beyond reputePWDR8S has a reputation beyond reputePWDR8S has a reputation beyond reputePWDR8S has a reputation beyond reputePWDR8S has a reputation beyond reputePWDR8S has a reputation beyond reputePWDR8S has a reputation beyond reputePWDR8S has a reputation beyond reputePWDR8S has a reputation beyond reputePWDR8S has a reputation beyond repute
Trust me on this one guys.... This one really rocks!

I was fortunate enough to do field testing of the reactor for almost 2 months and I had a really really tough time returning it. I just didn't want to let it go, it was that impressive. I took it up top o the rock pile in 50+ winds and I was stunned that I got it lit and it boiled up some water.... mind you, it took a little longer what with the winds stealing away the heat...but it did it!

Rain, snow, hail... I tried to find any and all of the nastiest situations to use it and of course regular camping fun. I had no problems except knocking it over when an overzealous pup wanted to play. You can even heat up your tent quickly with one(not recommended but it sure helped).
I wonder if there have been any changes from my prototype to the finished product? Doesn't appear so form the looks.

Figures they pushed the release back to June..... Like most products, they aim for a date and it gets pushed back and again and again.

I can't wait to get mine! Yippeeee! I earned credits for testing the stove so I saved the cred for the purchase of one of these. Well worth the wait in my book.

One of the nicer things about this is the pan is wider than what Jetboil offers in their package... If you're a one cup coffee/tea and then one pot meal, this is the ticket.


ADD: I forgot to mention the stove I tested had push button ignition and it worked EVERYTIME.
__________________
Carvé Diem!
Energy follows thought


Last edited by PWDR8S; 05-07-2007 at 03:43 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 05-07-2007, 05:41 PM
Ispoiler Ispoiler is offline
Toni Matt Club *
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Truckee, Ca
Posts: 940
Ispoiler has much to be proud ofIspoiler has much to be proud ofIspoiler has much to be proud ofIspoiler has much to be proud ofIspoiler has much to be proud ofIspoiler has much to be proud ofIspoiler has much to be proud ofIspoiler has much to be proud ofIspoiler has much to be proud ofIspoiler has much to be proud of
Send a message via AIM to Ispoiler
Having missed meals when promised a gas would work at 9k and did not, has there been any testing at altitude of this mix? The hardcore preheat canisters for use in higher, colder areas, that kinda scares me! Def seems like the ticket for its intended range, I can't wait to try one.
__________________
The challenge is not just to find peace but to be peace.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 05-07-2007, 07:41 PM
NtrentT's Avatar
NtrentT NtrentT is offline
Toni Matt Club *
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Pine Meadow, Connecticut
Posts: 3,712
NtrentT has a reputation beyond reputeNtrentT has a reputation beyond reputeNtrentT has a reputation beyond reputeNtrentT has a reputation beyond reputeNtrentT has a reputation beyond reputeNtrentT has a reputation beyond reputeNtrentT has a reputation beyond reputeNtrentT has a reputation beyond reputeNtrentT has a reputation beyond reputeNtrentT has a reputation beyond reputeNtrentT has a reputation beyond repute
Send a message via AIM to NtrentT
I like my jetboil, Ive used it for several years but....
I usually bring a white gas stove with me, the Primus Vari-fuel because I have started not to trust the Jetboil.

I found on my Garfield trip this past season, the Jetboil hardly worked, and one day the temp at night registered -4 it did not boil.

So now I'm just looking for a nice titanium pot and am going to use the white gas exclusively.

Heres a link to a comparison report on backcountryagenda between a whisperlight and a snowpeak. Iso Vs. WG.

I will continue to use the JB on casual day trips when I want something warm but really nothing else.

http://www.techsourceconsultants.com...hp?topic=574.0
__________________
~Say hello to the rug's topography, It holds quite a lot of interest with your face down on it~

Looking for a place to put your photos try BackcountryAgenda
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 05-07-2007, 07:49 PM
RR's Avatar
RR RR is offline
Moderator
Toni Matt Club **
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: following Diogenes, but the ba$tard threw away the lamp so I'm just stumbling along in the dark!
Posts: 13,750
RR has a reputation beyond reputeRR has a reputation beyond reputeRR has a reputation beyond reputeRR has a reputation beyond reputeRR has a reputation beyond reputeRR has a reputation beyond reputeRR has a reputation beyond reputeRR has a reputation beyond reputeRR has a reputation beyond reputeRR has a reputation beyond reputeRR has a reputation beyond repute
Quote:
Originally Posted by NtrentT
I like my jetboil, Ive used it for several years but....
I usually bring a white gas stove with me, the Primus Vari-fuel because I have started not to trust the Jetboil.

I found on my Garfield trip this past season, the Jetboil hardly worked, and one day the temp at night registered -4 it did not boil.

So now I'm just looking for a nice titanium pot and am going to use the white gas exclusively.

Heres a link to a comparison report on backcountryagenda between a whisperlight and a snowpeak. Iso Vs. WG.

I will continue to use the JB on casual day trips when I want something warm but really nothing else.

http://www.techsourceconsultants.com...hp?topic=574.0
That's overly harsh. There are things you can do to make it better in the cold, but it is awesome for the heart of summer. That's when I take my Pocket Rocket stove, but that canister stove is a late Spring through early Fall cooker.

I too am interested in the Reactor's alti performance...that regulator may be the ticket for an extra 2-3 thousand feet!
__________________
"Moderate is not the new Low" - Chris Joosen, USFS Lead Snow Ranger.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 05-07-2007, 07:56 PM
NtrentT's Avatar
NtrentT NtrentT is offline
Toni Matt Club *
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Pine Meadow, Connecticut
Posts: 3,712
NtrentT has a reputation beyond reputeNtrentT has a reputation beyond reputeNtrentT has a reputation beyond reputeNtrentT has a reputation beyond reputeNtrentT has a reputation beyond reputeNtrentT has a reputation beyond reputeNtrentT has a reputation beyond reputeNtrentT has a reputation beyond reputeNtrentT has a reputation beyond reputeNtrentT has a reputation beyond reputeNtrentT has a reputation beyond repute
Send a message via AIM to NtrentT
Im slightly jaded because the JB doesn't seem to be too durable and its fuel diffuser screens are nowhere to be found. A buddy of mine has a new one and it works better but of course in optimal environments.

I do like the click = "poof" flame convenience though, and it does package up into a nice package.

The top of mine cracked at the AVI class at hojos, so if its 5F out dont try to press down the cover or it will split. Those you can find at EMS.
__________________
~Say hello to the rug's topography, It holds quite a lot of interest with your face down on it~

Looking for a place to put your photos try BackcountryAgenda
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 05-07-2007, 08:02 PM
RR's Avatar
RR RR is offline
Moderator
Toni Matt Club **
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: following Diogenes, but the ba$tard threw away the lamp so I'm just stumbling along in the dark!
Posts: 13,750
RR has a reputation beyond reputeRR has a reputation beyond reputeRR has a reputation beyond reputeRR has a reputation beyond reputeRR has a reputation beyond reputeRR has a reputation beyond reputeRR has a reputation beyond reputeRR has a reputation beyond reputeRR has a reputation beyond reputeRR has a reputation beyond reputeRR has a reputation beyond repute
Quote:
Originally Posted by NtrentT
...The top of mine cracked at the AVI class at hojos, so if its 5F out dont try to press down the cover or it will split. Those you can find at EMS.
Not the first either...that's a PITA! You got the Coffee Press version of the cover to replace? They are supposed to be somewhat better.
__________________
"Moderate is not the new Low" - Chris Joosen, USFS Lead Snow Ranger.
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 05-07-2007, 08:23 PM
NtrentT's Avatar
NtrentT NtrentT is offline
Toni Matt Club *
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Pine Meadow, Connecticut
Posts: 3,712
NtrentT has a reputation beyond reputeNtrentT has a reputation beyond reputeNtrentT has a reputation beyond reputeNtrentT has a reputation beyond reputeNtrentT has a reputation beyond reputeNtrentT has a reputation beyond reputeNtrentT has a reputation beyond reputeNtrentT has a reputation beyond reputeNtrentT has a reputation beyond reputeNtrentT has a reputation beyond reputeNtrentT has a reputation beyond repute
Send a message via AIM to NtrentT
No I dont have the coffee press, I have the original one, but the press does look nice, but its just too much $$
__________________
~Say hello to the rug's topography, It holds quite a lot of interest with your face down on it~

Looking for a place to put your photos try BackcountryAgenda

Last edited by NtrentT; 05-07-2007 at 10:21 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 05-07-2007, 10:39 PM
davidhowland14's Avatar
davidhowland14 davidhowland14 is offline
Toni Matt Club *
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Gallatin County, MT
Posts: 1,281
davidhowland14 has a brilliant futuredavidhowland14 has a brilliant futuredavidhowland14 has a brilliant futuredavidhowland14 has a brilliant futuredavidhowland14 has a brilliant futuredavidhowland14 has a brilliant futuredavidhowland14 has a brilliant futuredavidhowland14 has a brilliant futuredavidhowland14 has a brilliant futuredavidhowland14 has a brilliant futuredavidhowland14 has a brilliant future
Send a message via ICQ to davidhowland14 Send a message via AIM to davidhowland14
i've found that jetboils really slow down in the cold, almost to the speed of a normal stove, and then you're stuck with the small pot. My other camping stoves use an butane-propane mix which seperates at cold temps and burns very slowly. other than a propane stove (MSR one), the only really reliable stove I have found that works well at cold temps and wouldn't be affected by altitude (i think) is my pepsican alcohol stove. Tiny, wieghtless, fuel can be bought anywhere. just don't put it on a snowbank, it'll melt it's way to the ground. it still boils in just under 4 minutes, but you can't control the heat level (no simmer) and you can't turn it off.

I do like the looks of the Reactor, though. thanks for posting the review. $140 seems a tad steep, though. is that the final price? also, you can get a group cooking setup for the jetboil (heat exchanger stuck on a bigger pot). could you get the same for the reactor?
__________________
Frigid Light Photography
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 05-08-2007, 08:22 AM
RR's Avatar
RR RR is offline
Moderator
Toni Matt Club **
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: following Diogenes, but the ba$tard threw away the lamp so I'm just stumbling along in the dark!
Posts: 13,750
RR has a reputation beyond reputeRR has a reputation beyond reputeRR has a reputation beyond reputeRR has a reputation beyond reputeRR has a reputation beyond reputeRR has a reputation beyond reputeRR has a reputation beyond reputeRR has a reputation beyond reputeRR has a reputation beyond reputeRR has a reputation beyond reputeRR has a reputation beyond repute
Quote:
Originally Posted by davidhowland14
....also, you can get a group cooking setup for the jetboil (heat exchanger stuck on a bigger pot). could you get the same for the reactor?
I would be very suprized if a larger pot for the Reactor did not appear in the second year.

My old Whisperlight International runs on just about anything and have never failed....its only serious drawback (imo) is the stove stench when it is shut down. Fortunately it can be moved out of the tent before shutdown if one is careful about it.
__________________
"Moderate is not the new Low" - Chris Joosen, USFS Lead Snow Ranger.
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 05-09-2007, 10:18 AM
jshefftz's Avatar
jshefftz jshefftz is offline
Toni Matt Club
   
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Amherst, Mass.
Posts: 1,148
jshefftz has a reputation beyond reputejshefftz has a reputation beyond reputejshefftz has a reputation beyond reputejshefftz has a reputation beyond reputejshefftz has a reputation beyond reputejshefftz has a reputation beyond reputejshefftz has a reputation beyond reputejshefftz has a reputation beyond reputejshefftz has a reputation beyond reputejshefftz has a reputation beyond reputejshefftz has a reputation beyond repute
Any canister stove will work fine at altitude regarding air pressure -- it's the typically colder temps and higher winds at altitude that diminish canister stove performance. (Although the Jetboil copes much better than regular canister stoves, and the new Reactor certainly looks promising - now if only REI currently stocked it so I could use my 20% off coupon.)

Regarding attempts to boost more performance out of a canister stove by preheating the canister, check out the test at backpackinglight.com for how vulnerable canisters are to exploding because of extra heat.
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 05-09-2007, 10:37 AM
RR's Avatar
RR RR is offline
Moderator
Toni Matt Club **
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: following Diogenes, but the ba$tard threw away the lamp so I'm just stumbling along in the dark!
Posts: 13,750
RR has a reputation beyond reputeRR has a reputation beyond reputeRR has a reputation beyond reputeRR has a reputation beyond reputeRR has a reputation beyond reputeRR has a reputation beyond reputeRR has a reputation beyond reputeRR has a reputation beyond reputeRR has a reputation beyond reputeRR has a reputation beyond reputeRR has a reputation beyond repute
Thanks J., here is the link: http://www.backpackinglight.com/cgi-...erheating.html

You will see a precis, but if you want to read the whole story of the test and see the results you have to subscribe for almost 25 bucks. I did so and here is what happened to the test subject canister:

The canister was put in a pot of cool water that was brought to 208F (short of boiling) on an electric hotplate. At about 14 minutes the canister ruptured and released a cloud of gas vapor with a loud BANG!. The cloud of gas then proceded to condense before dissapating in a light breeze. Due to a lack of ignition source the cloud was not a ball of flame.

EDIT: The bottom of the canister was deformed and stayed in the pot. The top, however, went on a lengthy trip into the air and landed quite a distance from the test site. If there had been an ingnition source the forces would have been greater by a considerable margin!

Useing a hand warmer pack to heat the canister seems unlikely to get the canister to 208F.
__________________
"Moderate is not the new Low" - Chris Joosen, USFS Lead Snow Ranger.

Last edited by RR; 05-09-2007 at 01:00 PM.
Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 05:27 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2013, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.